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Plato · Complete work

Stephanus 50

Stephanus 50 of 76. Read it here for reference, or continue through the entire work without leaving the reader.

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Original Ancient Greek

50a μόνον ἐκεῖνο αὖ προσαγορεύειν τῷ τε τοῦτο καὶ τῷ τόδε προσχρωμένους ὀνόματι, τὸ δὲ ὁποιονοῦν τι, θερμὸν ἢ λευκὸν ἢ καὶ ὁτιοῦν τῶν ἐναντίων, καὶ πάνθʼ ὅσα ἐκ τούτων, μηδὲν ἐκεῖνο αὖ τούτων καλεῖν. ἔτι δὲ σαφέστερον αὐτοῦ πέρι προθυμητέον αὖθις εἰπεῖν. εἰ γὰρ πάντα τις σχήματα πλάσας ἐκ χρυσοῦ μηδὲν μεταπλάττων παύοιτο ἕκαστα εἰς ἅπαντα, δεικνύντος δή τινος αὐτῶν ἓν καὶ ἐρομένου 50b τί ποτʼ ἐστί, μακρῷ πρὸς ἀλήθειαν ἀσφαλέστατον εἰπεῖν ὅτι χρυσός, τὸ δὲ τρίγωνον ὅσα τε ἄλλα σχήματα ἐνεγίγνετο, μηδέποτε λέγειν ταῦτα ὡς ὄντα, ἅ γε μεταξὺ τιθεμένου μεταπίπτει, ἀλλʼ ἐὰν ἄρα καὶ τὸ τοιοῦτον μετʼ ἀσφαλείας ἐθέλῃ δέχεσθαί τινος, ἀγαπᾶν. ὁ αὐτὸς δὴ λόγος καὶ περὶ τῆς τὰ πάντα δεχομένης σώματα φύσεως. ταὐτὸν αὐτὴν ἀεὶ προσρητέον· ἐκ γὰρ τῆς ἑαυτῆς τὸ παράπαν οὐκ ἐξίσταται δυνάμεως—δέχεταί τε γὰρ ἀεὶ τὰ πάντα, καὶ 50c μορφὴν οὐδεμίαν ποτὲ οὐδενὶ τῶν εἰσιόντων ὁμοίαν εἴληφεν οὐδαμῇ οὐδαμῶς· ἐκμαγεῖον γὰρ φύσει παντὶ κεῖται, κινούμενόν τε καὶ διασχηματιζόμενον ὑπὸ τῶν εἰσιόντων, φαίνεται δὲ διʼ ἐκεῖνα ἄλλοτε ἀλλοῖον—τὰ δὲ εἰσιόντα καὶ ἐξιόντα τῶν ὄντων ἀεὶ μιμήματα, τυπωθέντα ἀπʼ αὐτῶν τρόπον τινὰ δύσφραστον καὶ θαυμαστόν, ὃν εἰς αὖθις μέτιμεν. ἐν δʼ οὖν τῷ παρόντι χρὴ γένη διανοηθῆναι τριττά, τὸ μὲν 50d γιγνόμενον, τὸ δʼ ἐν ᾧ γίγνεται, τὸ δʼ ὅθεν ἀφομοιούμενον φύεται τὸ γιγνόμενον. καὶ δὴ καὶ προσεικάσαι πρέπει τὸ μὲν δεχόμενον μητρί, τὸ δʼ ὅθεν πατρί, τὴν δὲ μεταξὺ τούτων φύσιν ἐκγόνῳ, νοῆσαί τε ὡς οὐκ ἂν ἄλλως, ἐκτυπώματος ἔσεσθαι μέλλοντος ἰδεῖν ποικίλου πάσας ποικιλίας, τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ ἐν ᾧ ἐκτυπούμενον ἐνίσταται γένοιτʼ ἂν παρεσκευασμένον εὖ, πλὴν ἄμορφον ὂν ἐκείνων ἁπασῶν τῶν ἰδεῶν ὅσας 50e μέλλοι δέχεσθαί ποθεν. ὅμοιον γὰρ ὂν τῶν ἐπεισιόντων τινὶ τὰ τῆς ἐναντίας τά τε τῆς τὸ παράπαν ἄλλης φύσεως ὁπότʼ ἔλθοι δεχόμενον κακῶς ἂν ἀφομοιοῖ, τὴν αὑτοῦ παρεμφαῖνον ὄψιν. διὸ καὶ πάντων ἐκτὸς εἰδῶν εἶναι χρεὼν τὸ τὰ πάντα ἐκδεξόμενον ἐν αὑτῷ γένη, καθάπερ περὶ τὰ ἀλείμματα ὁπόσα εὐώδη τέχνῃ μηχανῶνται πρῶτον τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ ὑπάρχον, ποιοῦσιν ὅτι μάλιστα ἀώδη τὰ δεξόμενα ὑγρὰ τὰς ὀσμάς· ὅσοι τε ἔν τισιν τῶν μαλακῶν σχήματα ἀπομάττειν ἐπιχειροῦσι, τὸ παράπαν σχῆμα οὐδὲν ἔνδηλον ὑπάρχειν ἐῶσι, προομαλύναντες δὲ ὅτι λειότατον ἀπεργάζονται.

Musean translation

Mouseia's complete machine-assisted Musean translation, made directly from the complete Greek text (John Burnet's Oxford edition, Perseus Digital Library) across all 76 Stephanus pages and 364 sections, including the Atlantis prologue (20d–26e), for fidelity, philosophical precision, dialogue, and structure.

50a only that thing, in turn, is to be addressed by way of the names 'this' and 'that', while whatever qualified thing it may chance to be—the hot, the white, any of the opposites, and everything made from these—none of these is ever to be used as its name. But here again we must press for still greater clarity about it. If someone were to mold every manner of shape out of gold and, without recasting it, kept remaking each into every other, and someone pointed to one of them and asked 50b what in truth it was, the safest answer by far, with truth in view, would be to say that it is gold—and never to speak of the triangle, or whatever other shapes had been forming, as things that are, since they shift even while the gold is being posed; and if anyone were willing to accept even such a statement with assurance, we should be content with that. The same account holds for the nature that receives all bodies: it must always be called by the same name, for it never altogether departs from its own power—it always receives all things, and 50c it has never in any way taken on any form resembling any of the things that enter it. For it is laid beneath all nature like a block ready for the stamp, moved and reshaped by the things that enter it, and through them it appears different at different times. And the things that enter and leave are always copies of the things that are, stamped from them in a manner hard to express and marvelous—a manner to which we will return later. For the present, then, we must conceive three kinds: 50d that which comes to be, that in which it comes to be, and that from which the coming thing, being copied, grows. And it is right to liken the receiver to a mother, the source to a father, and the nature between these two to their offspring. We must also grasp that it could not be otherwise: if an imprint is going to show all the variety of a variegated form, that very thing in which the imprinting settles must be well prepared for it—except that it be formless, empty of all those forms 50e it is someday to receive from somewhere. For if it were like any of the things entering it, then whenever it had to receive something of the opposite kind, of an altogether different nature, it would copy it badly, showing its own appearance alongside. And so the thing that is to receive into itself all kinds must of necessity stand outside all forms. Just as in the case of the unguents—all those that men contrive by art to be fragrant, they first make the liquids that are to receive the scents as odorless as they can; and those who undertake to stamp shapes into soft materials let no shape at all be evident in them, but smooth them and make them as smooth as they can be made.

Plain English translation

Mouseia's complete Plain English edition, made independently and directly from all 76 Stephanus pages of the Greek.

50a We should call only that one 'this' or 'that', applying both names to it; but no quality—hot or white or anything among the opposites, and nothing that comes from them—should ever be called 'this' or 'that'. We must try once more to speak about it more clearly. If someone made all kinds of shape out of gold and went on reshaping each one into all the others without ever stopping, and someone pointed to one of them and asked 50b what it is, by far the safest answer and the truest is to say 'gold'. We should never say that the triangle, or any of the other shapes that come and go in it, are real, since they change even as we name them. If someone is willing to accept even a name like that with some confidence, we should be satisfied. The same account applies to the nature that receives all bodies. We must always call it by the same name, since it never departs at all from its own power. It always receives everything, and 50c it never takes on any shape like the shape of any of the things that enter it, in any way at all. By nature it lies there like a mold for everything, and it is moved and given shape by the things that enter it; because of them it looks different at different times. The things that enter and leave it are always copies of what is, stamped from them in a way that is hard to describe and wonderful, and this we will take up again later. For now we must think of three kinds: 50d what comes to be, that in which it comes to be, and that from which what comes to be is copied and grows. And we may fairly compare the thing that receives to a mother, the source to a father, and the nature in between them to their child. And we must understand that when a stamp carrying every kind of variety is going to appear, the thing in which the stamping is set could not be well prepared in any other way than by being free of all the shapes it is going to receive from somewhere. 50e If it were like any of the things that come into it, then when it received something of the opposite kind, or of a wholly different nature, it would copy it badly, and show its own appearance along with it. That is why the thing that is to receive all kinds in itself must be free of every form. It is the same with scented oils: the makers first make sure of this very thing, and make the liquids that are to hold the smells as free of smell as possible. And those who try to press shapes into soft materials leave no shape showing in them at all beforehand; they smooth them out first and make them as even as possible.

R. G. Bury (1929) translation

Public-domain Loeb translation from the Greek (Plato in Twelve Volumes, vol. 9, Harvard University Press, 1929), in the Perseus Digital Library's digital text, with the same Stephanus pages and sections as the Greek.

50a coming severally into existence, and wherefrom in turn they perish, in describing that and that alone should we employ the terms this and that; whereas, in describing what is suchlike—hot, for instance, or white, or any of the opposite qualities, or any compounds thereof—we ought never to apply to it any of these terms.

But we must bestir ourselves to explain this matter again yet more clearly. Now imagine that a man were to model all possible figures out of gold, and were then to proceed without cessation to remodel each of these into every other, then, if someone were to point to one of the figures and ask what it is, 50b by far the safest reply, in point of truth, would be that it is gold; but as for the triangle and all the other figures which were formed in it, one should never describe them as being seeing that they change even while one is mentioning them; rather one should be content if the figure admits of even the title suchlike being applied to it with any safety. And of the substance which receives all bodies 50c the same account must be given. It must be called always by the same name; for from its own proper quality it never departs at all for while it is always receiving all things, nowhere and in no wise does it assume any shape similar to any of the things that enter into it. For it is laid down by nature as a molding-stuff for everything, being moved and marked by the entering figures, and because of them it appears different at different times. And the figures that enter and depart are copies of those that are always existent, being stamped from them in a fashion marvellous and hard to describe, which we shall investigate hereafter.

For the present, then, we must conceive of three kinds,—the Becoming, that Wherein it becomes, and the source Wherefrom the Becoming 50d is copied and produced. Moreover, it is proper to liken the Recipient to the Mother, the Source to the Father, and what is engendered between these two to the Offspring; and also to perceive that, if the stamped copy is to assume diverse appearances of all sorts, that substance wherein it is set and stamped could not possibly be suited to its purpose unless it were itself devoid of all those forms which it is about to receive from any quarter. 50e For were it similar to any of the entering forms, on receiving forms of an opposite or wholly different kind, as they arrived, it would copy them badly, through obtruding its own visible shape. Wherefore it is right that the substance which is to receive within itself all the kinds should be void of all forms; just as with all fragrant ointments, men bring about this condition by artistic contrivance and make the liquids which are to receive the odors as odorless as possible; and all who essay to mold figures in any soft material utterly refuse to allow any previous figure to remain visible therein, and begin by making it even and as smooth as possible before they execute the work.

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