Mouseiaan open library of the ancient world

Book 2, Chapter 3

61 of 130 chapters in On Divination by Marcus Tullius Cicero

Original Latin

8 Nam cum de divinatione Quintus frater ea disseruisset, quae superiore libro scripta sunt, satisque ambulatum videretur, tum in bibliotheca, quae in Lycio est, adsedimus. Atque ego: Adcurate tu quidem, inquam, Quinte, et Stoice Stoicorum sententiam defendisti, quodque me maxime delectat, plurimis nostris exemplis usus es, et iis quidem claris et inlustribus. Dicendum est mihi igitur ad ea, quae sunt a te dicta, sed ita, nihil ut adfirmem, quaeram omnia, dubitans plerumque et mihi ipse diffidens. Si enim aliquid certi haberem, quod dicerem, ego ipse divinarem, qui esse divinationem nego.

9 Etenim me movet illud, quod in primis Carneades quaerere solebat, quarumnam rerum divinatio esset, earumne, quae sensibus perciperentur. At eas quidem cernimus, audimus, gustamus, olfacimus, tangimus. Num quid ergo in his rebus est, quod provisione aut permotione mentis magis quam natura ipsa sentiamus? aut num nescio qui ille divinus, si oculis captus sit, ut Tiresias fuit, possit, quae alba sint, quae nigra, dicere aut, si surdus sit, varietates vocum aut modos noscere? Ad nullam igitur earum rerum, quae sensu accipiuntur, divinatio adhibetur. Atqui ne in iis quidem rebus, quae arte tractantur, divinatione opus est. Etenim ad aegros non vates aut hariolos, sed medicos solemus adducere, nec vero, qui fidibus aut tibiis uti volunt, ab haruspicibus accipiunt earum tractationem, sed a musicis.

Musean translation

Complete machine-assisted Musean translation, made directly from the Latin in separate source-only tasks and reviewed throughout against it. Both books, all 130 chapters and 282 numbered sections; no historical English translation used. Latin transcription credited to the Perseus Project under CC BY-SA 4.0, Müller’s 1915 Teubner edition.

8 After my brother Quintus had delivered the argument on divination recorded in the preceding book, and we thought we had walked enough, we sat down in the library in the Lyceum. Then I said: “Quintus, you have defended the Stoic position with precision and in true Stoic style. And what especially delights me is your use of so many examples from our own history, striking and distinguished examples too. I must therefore answer what you have said, but in such a way that I assert nothing and question everything, generally doubting and mistrusting even myself. If I had anything certain to pronounce, I should myself be practicing divination—I who deny that divination exists.

9 “For I am troubled by the question Carneades was particularly fond of asking: what is divination about? Is it about things we perceive through our senses? But those are things we see, hear, taste, smell, and touch. Is there anything in them that foreknowledge or some agitation of the mind enables us to perceive better than our natural faculties do? Could your supposed diviner, if he were blind as Tiresias was, tell what is white and what is black? Or, if deaf, recognize differences of voices or musical modes? Divination, then, has no application to anything apprehended by the senses. Nor is it needed in matters governed by skill. When people are ill, we generally bring them doctors, not prophets or soothsayers; and those who wish to play the lyre or pipes learn to handle them from musicians, not from haruspices.

Plain English translation

Complete machine-assisted Plain English translation, made independently and directly from the Latin, never from the Musean edition. Both books and every numbered section; a separate Latin-source model review covered the entire text. No human specialist review is claimed.

8 My brother Quintus had finished the discussion of divination recorded in the previous book. After what seemed a sufficient walk, we took seats in the Lyceum’s library. I then said, “Quintus, you have defended the Stoic position carefully, and in true Stoic style. What pleases me most is that you have used so many examples from our own history, and famous, striking examples at that. Now I must answer what you have said. But I will assert nothing and question everything, often uncertain and doubtful of my own judgment. If I had anything certain to say, I would be practicing divination myself, though I deny that divination exists.

9 “What troubles me is a question Carneades used to press above all: what things does divination deal with? Things we perceive through our senses? Yet sight, hearing, taste, smell, and touch already tell us about those things. Is there anything in this field that we perceive through foresight or mental excitement rather than through our natural senses? Could some supposed diviner, if he were blind like Tiresias, tell us what was white and what was black? Or, if he were deaf, could he recognize different voices or musical tunes? So divination has no use in anything we learn through our senses. Nor do we need it in things dealt with by trained skills. We normally bring doctors to the sick, not prophets or fortune-tellers. A musician, not a haruspex, teaches anyone wishing to play the pipes or a stringed instrument how to use it.

About this section

Book 2, Chapter 3 is part of On Divination by Marcus Tullius Cicero. This page sets the Latin original beside 2 direct-source translations, so any line can be checked against the source. It is chapter 61 of 130 in the work, which is kept in the Roman tradition.

Open the work page for the full contents, every edition, and the download links, or go back to Explore to browse other complete works in the Roman tradition. The reader keeps your place when you are signed in and lets you compare the original with each translation, one edition at a time.

Download the complete work as JSON · Retex Markdown