Book 2, Chapter 59
Original Latin
121 Iam ex insanorum aut ebriorum visis innumerabilia coniectura trahi possunt, quae futura videantur […] Quis est enim, qui totum diem iaculans non aliquando conliniet? Totas noctes somniamus, neque ulla est fere, qua non dormiamus, et miramur aliquando id, quod somniarimus, evadere? Quid est tam incertum quam talorum iactus? tamen nemo est, quin saepe iactans Venerium iaciat aliquando, non numquam etiam iterum ac tertium. Num igitur, ut inepti, Veneris id inpulsu fieri malumus quam casu dicere? Quodsi ceteris temporibus falsis visis credendum non est, non video, quid praecipui somnus habeat, in quo valeant falsa pro veris.
122 Quodsi ita natura paratum esset, ut ea dormientes agerent, quae somniarent, alligandi omnes essent, qui cubitum irent; maiores enim quam ulli insani efficerent motus somniantes. Quodsi insanorum visis fides non est habenda, quia falsa sunt, cur credatur somniantium visis, quae multo etiam perturbatiora sunt, non intellego; an quod insani sua visa coniectori non narrant, narrant, qui somniaverunt? Quaero etiam, si velim scribere quid aut legere aut canere vel voce vel fidibus aut geometricum quiddam aut physicum aut dialecticum explicare, somniumne exspectandum sit an ars adhibenda; sine qua nihil earum rerum nec fieri nec expediri potest. Atqui, ne si navigare quidem velim, ita gubernem, ut somniaverim; praesens enim poena sit.
123 Qui igitur convenit aegros a coniectore somniorum potius quam a medico petere medicinam? An Aesculapius, an Serapis potest nobis praescribere per somnum curationem valetudinis, Neptunus gubernantibus non potest? et si sine medico medicinam dabit Minerva, Musae scribendi, legendi, ceterarum artium scientiam somniantibus non dabunt? At si curatio daretur valetudinis, haec quoque, quae dixi, darentur; quae quoniam non dantur, medicina non datur; qua sublata tollitur omnis auctoritas somniorum.
Musean translation
Complete machine-assisted Musean translation, made directly from the Latin in separate source-only tasks and reviewed throughout against it. Both books, all 130 chapters and 282 numbered sections; no historical English translation used. Latin transcription credited to the Perseus Project under CC BY-SA 4.0, Müller’s 1915 Teubner edition.
121 “From the visions of madmen or drunkards, too, countless conjectures can be drawn about apparent future events […] For who can throw a javelin all day without sometimes hitting the mark? We dream all night, and scarcely a night passes without our sleeping; yet we wonder that something we dreamed should sometimes come to pass! What is more uncertain than a throw of knucklebones? Still, no one throws them repeatedly without at some point making the Venus throw, sometimes even a second and third time. Are we so foolish that we would rather say Venus prompted it than that chance produced it? If false visions are not to be trusted at other times, I cannot see what special privilege sleep possesses, that in it falsehood should have the force of truth.
122 “If nature had arranged for sleepers to act out their dreams, everyone going to bed would have to be tied down: dreamers would cause greater disturbances than any madmen. If we must put no faith in madmen’s visions because they are false, I cannot see why we should believe dreamers’ visions, which are even more disordered. Is it because madmen do not recount their visions to an interpreter, while people who have dreamed do? I ask this too: if I want to write or read something, sing or play the lyre, or explain a point of geometry, physics, or dialectic, should I wait for a dream or employ an art? Without such an art, none of these things can be done or worked out. Indeed, if I wanted to sail, I would not steer as I had dreamed: the penalty would be immediate.
123 “How can it make sense, then, for the sick to seek treatment from an interpreter of dreams rather than a doctor? Can Aesculapius or Serapis prescribe us a cure in sleep, while Neptune cannot give helmsmen instructions for their craft? And if Minerva gives medical treatment without a doctor, will the Muses not give dreamers knowledge of writing, reading, and the other arts? If a cure for illness were given in dreams, these other gifts I have mentioned would be given too. Since they are not given, neither is medical treatment. Remove that, and all the authority of dreams is gone.
Plain English translation
Complete machine-assisted Plain English translation, made independently and directly from the Latin, never from the Musean edition. Both books and every numbered section; a separate Latin-source model review covered the entire text. No human specialist review is claimed.
121 “And from what mad or drunk people see we could draw countless guesses about apparent future events […] After all, who could throw spears all day without sometimes hitting the target? We dream all night, and there is hardly a night we do not sleep. Yet we are surprised that something we have dreamed sometimes happens! Can anything be less predictable than the way knucklebones fall? Still, anyone who throws them often will sometimes get a Venus throw, and sometimes get it a second and a third time. Shall we foolishly prefer to say that Venus made this happen, rather than chance? If we should not believe false visions at other times, I cannot see what special quality sleep has that lets false visions count as true.
122 “Suppose nature made us perform in our sleep whatever we dreamed of doing. We would have to tie up everyone who lay down to sleep. Dreamers would cause more disturbance than any mad people. We should not trust mad people's visions because they are false. Why, then, should we trust sleepers' visions, which are even more confused? I do not understand. Is it because mad people do not tell an interpreter what they saw, but dreamers do? Here is another question. If I want to write or read something, sing, play a stringed instrument, or explain a point in geometry, physics, or logic, must I wait for a dream, or use a learned skill? Without skill, none of those things can be done or worked out. Even if I decided to go sailing, I would refuse to let a dream tell me how to steer. The penalty would be immediate.
123 “So how does it make sense for sick people to seek treatment from a dream interpreter rather than a doctor? Can Aesculapius or Serapis prescribe treatment for our health in a dream, but Neptune cannot give helmsmen instructions about sailing? And if a dream lets Minerva treat us with no doctor involved, why would the Muses withhold from sleepers the ability to write, read, and practice the remaining arts? If treatment for health were given, the other things I mentioned would be given too. Since they are not, medical treatment is not given. Take that away, and all the authority of dreams disappears.
About this section
Book 2, Chapter 59 is part of On Divination by Marcus Tullius Cicero. This page sets the Latin original beside 2 direct-source translations, so any line can be checked against the source. It is chapter 117 of 130 in the work, which is kept in the Roman tradition.
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